Comments on: The Adventure Begins or My first day at 1/2 http://www.visitthesaint.com/2006/12/12/the-adventure-begins-or-my-first-day-at-12/ Sun, 08 Jan 2012 15:34:21 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: The Saint http://www.visitthesaint.com/2006/12/12/the-adventure-begins-or-my-first-day-at-12/comment-page-1/#comment-126 The Saint Wed, 13 Dec 2006 22:01:26 +0000 http://www.visitthesaint.com/blog/?p=88#comment-126 The range I think the guy is on in the 76 hand is 88+, AK, AQ. It's possibly wider, but this is a good range do use to do some math with. On the flop, I am 37.26% to win versus that range, or 1.68:1. With my flop push, I am betting $123 to win $193 (he never folds to my raise), or 1.57:1. So it's a fold, but it's closer than you think. If I try and then use the image I would for playing this hand loose-aggressive, it should make up the difference to make the play at least neutral EV. For the pre-flop call, I do really need the other guy to see the flop. The range I think the guy is on in the 76 hand is 88+, AK, AQ. It’s possibly wider, but this is a good range do use to do some math with. On the flop, I am 37.26% to win versus that range, or 1.68:1. With my flop push, I am betting $123 to win $193 (he never folds to my raise), or 1.57:1. So it’s a fold, but it’s closer than you think. If I try and then use the image I would for playing this hand loose-aggressive, it should make up the difference to make the play at least neutral EV. For the pre-flop call, I do really need the other guy to see the flop.

]]> By: joepro http://www.visitthesaint.com/2006/12/12/the-adventure-begins-or-my-first-day-at-12/comment-page-1/#comment-113 joepro Wed, 13 Dec 2006 18:07:58 +0000 http://www.visitthesaint.com/blog/?p=88#comment-113 Yeah, I guess you’re right about those hands being tough to value bet in a no limit game, but it’s the fear of getting raised that essentially leaves a lot of money out there (I got this from Thunder Keller, I didn’t make it up.) Just something to keep in mind, especially in shorthanded games. I do agree it’s a lot easier in a limit game. From what I can see, you are a fairly tight player, so they have to give you credit for something most of the time. I don’t imagine you would be getting raised on the river much. I still don’t get the 76 hand. It just seems like a very scary board to be raising into, where the preflop raiser is being aggressive, and you are probably a huge dog if you get called. <em>The only hand where I think I should have played the river differently is the 45 hand. Seems like it would be a lot easier to bet/fold in that spot.</em> Agreed. Yeah, I guess you’re right about those hands being tough to value bet in a no limit game, but it’s the fear of getting raised that essentially leaves a lot of money out there (I got this from Thunder Keller, I didn’t make it up.) Just something to keep in mind, especially in shorthanded games. I do agree it’s a lot easier in a limit game. From what I can see, you are a fairly tight player, so they have to give you credit for something most of the time. I don’t imagine you would be getting raised on the river much.

I still don’t get the 76 hand. It just seems like a very scary board to be raising into, where the preflop raiser is being aggressive, and you are probably a huge dog if you get called.

The only hand where I think I should have played the river differently is the 45 hand. Seems like it would be a lot easier to bet/fold in that spot.

Agreed.

]]> By: The Saint http://www.visitthesaint.com/2006/12/12/the-adventure-begins-or-my-first-day-at-12/comment-page-1/#comment-125 The Saint Wed, 13 Dec 2006 17:13:03 +0000 http://www.visitthesaint.com/blog/?p=88#comment-125 I somewhat agree with you on the 76 hand. I have no fold equity on my flop push. Looks like I forgot to reload after losing to trips two hands earlier. I always try to start every hand with at least 100bb. An extra 25bb does get me some fold equity. As for pre-flop, the button plays VERY loose so I expected him to come in as well. Maybe I was expecting too much from him, a re-raise is still a re-raise even if you are playing 70% of your hands. As for value betting rivers, I don't see these hands as spots where that isn't just asking for trouble. Hand 1: I am calling almost a pot sized bet with only a pair of aces on a board with a possible flush and straight. Hand 2: Again I only have top pair with a bunch of straights out there. Hand 3: Possible straight, flush and boat. Hand 7: Flush and straight possible. You need to remember that in no limit failed value bets are a lot more expensive than limit. The only hand where I think I should have played the river differently is the 45 hand. Seems like it would be a lot easier to bet/fold in that spot. I somewhat agree with you on the 76 hand. I have no fold equity on my flop push. Looks like I forgot to reload after losing to trips two hands earlier. I always try to start every hand with at least 100bb. An extra 25bb does get me some fold equity. As for pre-flop, the button plays VERY loose so I expected him to come in as well. Maybe I was expecting too much from him, a re-raise is still a re-raise even if you are playing 70% of your hands.

As for value betting rivers, I don’t see these hands as spots where that isn’t just asking for trouble.
Hand 1: I am calling almost a pot sized bet with only a pair of aces on a board with a possible flush and straight.
Hand 2: Again I only have top pair with a bunch of straights out there.
Hand 3: Possible straight, flush and boat.
Hand 7: Flush and straight possible.
You need to remember that in no limit failed value bets are a lot more expensive than limit. The only hand where I think I should have played the river differently is the 45 hand. Seems like it would be a lot easier to bet/fold in that spot.

]]> By: joepro http://www.visitthesaint.com/2006/12/12/the-adventure-begins-or-my-first-day-at-12/comment-page-1/#comment-112 joepro Wed, 13 Dec 2006 15:21:36 +0000 http://www.visitthesaint.com/blog/?p=88#comment-112 Wow. Awesome hand histories. Please post more of these. I will do the same, if others enjoy them as much as me. Last night I watched some great action on fulltilt, actually the best part was watching John Dagostino clean a guy out of around $20k, and then the guy bitched and moaned about how Dags sucked out on him. ”How can you call there?,” to which JDags replies ”If you know me, you should know I don’t like to fold.” The guy was only a 3-2 favorite in the hand, but the worst part was he tried to make dags feel bad because he said he lost his whole bankroll on that one hand. Oh yeah, then Matusow tried to play dags heads up, but dags refused because he said it’s a ”lose-lose situation” because Mike already owes dags money. But sorry to highjack your post, I love these hand histories! To me, you played great, but may want to consider value betting the river. Thomas Keller recommends this and it has helped me lately. The only hand I think you played poorly was the 67clubs, which you had the chance to get away from cheaply not once but twice. The hand where you had trip fives was a hard laydown imo. In a limit game, you probably a raise, but when someone bets their stack it’s hard to call. Wow. Awesome hand histories. Please post more of these. I will do the same, if others enjoy them as much as me. Last night I watched some great action on fulltilt, actually the best part was watching John Dagostino clean a guy out of around $20k, and then the guy bitched and moaned about how Dags sucked out on him. ”How can you call there?,” to which JDags replies ”If you know me, you should know I don’t like to fold.” The guy was only a 3-2 favorite in the hand, but the worst part was he tried to make dags feel bad because he said he lost his whole bankroll on that one hand. Oh yeah, then Matusow tried to play dags heads up, but dags refused because he said it’s a ”lose-lose situation” because Mike already owes dags money.

But sorry to highjack your post, I love these hand histories! To me, you played great, but may want to consider value betting the river. Thomas Keller recommends this and it has helped me lately. The only hand I think you played poorly was the 67clubs, which you had the chance to get away from cheaply not once but twice. The hand where you had trip fives was a hard laydown imo. In a limit game, you probably a raise, but when someone bets their stack it’s hard to call.

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